This archived forum used to be called 'Peatarian' (in reference to Ray Peat). It was closed because of the behavior of Danny Roddy and his posse.

Ray Peat switches to Hydrogenated Coconut Oil

asked Mar 13, 2015 by Anon
edited Mar 13, 2015 by Anon

Thanks for this link. Much appreciated.

Great interview! I loved it when asked to sum up about staying healthy and keeping our oxidation working well, Ray responds "Just keeping stress down and fun up, judging food largely by how it tastes, rather than by what the experts say." Awesome advice!

Anyhow, I was just thinking about how coconut oil and butter only contain about 2 or 3% PUFAs, but butter, especially grass-fed, also contains vitamin E which we know is protective against PUFAs and Ray even talks about this right before he mentions getting hydrogenated coconut oil. So does the 2 or 3% of PUFAs end up being a wash given the presence of vitamin E?

Also, does anyone know the date of this interview? I'm curious if this interview was done before or after Ray gave his most recent rundown of his diet because in it, he mentions daily consumption of butter, but not coconut oil.
Yes, I think Ray Peat is happy to exclude himself from the club of experts, though everyone else is elbowing to join.

It seems the interview was this past Thursday, 3/12/15. Was that before or after the rundown you have in mind?
Okay, thank you, P. That's after. His diet rundown was in late 2014 and his email to me was this past February where he mentions recommending butter and coconut oil.

I'm really curious what he'd have to say about what I questioned...that the vitamin E in butter counteracts the minor 2 or 3% PUFA content. If I remember correctly, peanut oil also contains vitamin E, though I wonder if industrial processing degrades it and renders it useless?
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/nigel.kinbrum/comparison-of-fats.gif

http://www.tropicaltraditions.com/images/vite.jpg

http://ancestral-nutrition.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/butterolive4.jpg

http://www.ars.usda.gov/SP2UserFiles/Place/80400525/Articles/AICR06_NutSeed.pdf

The small pufa amount in things like butter/cheese and tallow aren't even worth thinking about. Better to follow your tastebuds and eat what you crave/enjoy the most per meal.
Ooh...perfect! Thank you for posting those links, EliminateTheJuice. :)

2 Answers

I hear Peat talking about complete hydrogenation of coconut oil, which removes all unsaturated fats, both cis and trans forms.

It wasn't until he was able to find a supplier who could do complete hydrogenation of coconut oil that he switched.

As usual, he gives us lots to think about. Can we find a supplier of completely hydrogenated oil? Should we try to do complete hydrogenation of oil ourselves, the theory of which is explained in this video (but not the actual how-to)?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqdDWA9-DSY
answered Mar 14, 2015 by visionofstrength
edited Mar 14, 2015 by visionofstrength
"As usual, he gives us lots to think about. "

As usual he gives us lots to be paranoid about. Coconut oil is probably the most saturated of all fats. The percentage of PUFA is very small. Unless a person is ingesting a liter of coconut oil per day, what is the benefit of getting rid of the small amount of unsaturated fat?

Ray Peat is a very disturbed man. His obsession with PUFA is ridiculous. At his age, he should not be worrying about a few micrograms of unsaturated fat. If his interpretation of science and nutritional advice were correct, he would be the healthiest person on the planet. I know healthy people in their 80s who eat much more PUFA than Peat considers healthy. In spite of following Peat's advice, people still need un-physiological doses of supplements and prescription drugs, SMH.
@J. Thank you!

I see some sources claim that the melting point of coconut oil, if hydrogenation is complete, should be at 104 degrees F.

I wonder if the 92 degrees variety is an improvement, or leaves trans and cis saturated fats?

Peat also mentions fully hydrogenated peanut oil, so I wonder if that's a practical alternative?
Opinion noted, IG. Did you listen to the interview? What did you think?
Hmm...if they say 104 then I would think that is fully hydrogenated and not the 92, but is a melting point of 104 normal for an oil? I'm going to sound really dumb here so please forgive me, but if the melting point of the CO is 104 degrees and our internal body temperate is on average 98.6 or 99 - 100 degrees if you have a really smoking metabolism, wouldn't the oil solidify in us and how would that affect its digestion? Or is that where our stomach acid comes into play?
No, I think you're right. It might not "melt" in your mouth from temperature alone, unless you chewed it. And it might not melt on your skin unless you rubbed it in. But you could digest it once you swallowed.
Funny, my mind went to using it in skincare products, but then I imagined a chunky mess. I think I'll be sticking with my virgin CO, fractionated CO and cocoa butter for my beauty products. LOL
"One possibly crucial protective effect of vitamin E against the polyunsaturated fatty acids that hasn't been explored is the direct destruction of linolenic and linoleic acid. It is known that bacterial vitamin E is involved in the saturation of unsaturated fatty acids, and it is also known that intestinal bacteria turn linoleic and linolenic acids into the fully saturated stearic acid."
from:http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/vitamin-e.shtml

So perhaps one could discover the right colony of microorganism to convert PUFA and avoid such laborious work with undesirable solvents and catalysts.

How neat to hear Ray talk with people other than west coast hypochondriac hippies.

answered Mar 13, 2015 by 4a552f55cbb9
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